2024 is the Year of Linux on the Desktop, at least for my boyfriend. He’s running Windows 7 right now, so I’ll be switching him to Ubuntu in a few days. Ubuntu was chosen because Proton is officially supported in Ubuntu.
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it is kinda wild that people abandon Windows 7 because of Steam and not because Microsoft stopped patching it several years ago
Ubuntu was chosen because Proton is officially supported in Ubuntu.
I don’t think Steam actually recommends any distro since some time anymore
People don’t care about security until they get hit. Source: working in IT for 10 years.
And then suddenly they care a lot and do all the wrong things for wrong reasons because they know shit
“I don’t worry about missing security patches. I just have 5 anti-virus tools running simultaneously, they keep me safe.”
Or those people who actively avoid patches in general, because “they make my device slow”
I mean, they do make your device slow. That why tools like InSpectre exists. For some old cpu’s like my notebooks one it can be up to 20% performance impact, so if you not planning to use it with internet (or at least as main access point via browser) ever again, why not get yourself free performance?
sure, if you actually plan to take the device off the network, it should be fine. but that’s definitely not what most people who complain about that will do.
And all of the anti-virus tools are 50 updates behind so they’re essentially non-functional bloatware even moreso
I see it more in: people won’t switch for security reasons if it means giving up usability
In this case they could have switched to Windows 10 years ago and even 11 is perfectly fine, especially if you install it in English UK so a lot of the cleanup work is done for you.
This only is true if you have a pc that supports it. In my case windows 10 was the end station for my workstation
And it’s still getting updates until 2025 (more if you want to pay) and Windows 11 can be installed on hardware without TPM 2.0 (witch will be more than 10 years old when Windows 10 stops getting updates)…
At some point people have to accept that the world is moving forward and technology is continuously improving… At what point do you consider that your machine is old enough that it’s acceptable to retire it? Should I be able to install Windows 11 on my Pentium 150mhz?
Kek. I mainly use it for a little gaming. It has an i7 2600 and an rx6700xt. Works stellar for my usage, so if I can keep using it for the next 10 years I will.
We should stop retiring hardware that still meets demands
Even IT people don’t give a shit about security until it’s way too late. Source: getting out of a job where the median age of a server is around 3-4 years old with no updates and runtimes hard installed outside repositories.
I think this is just kind of a side effect of capitalism.
If it’s costing them in the short term, and the results aren’t evident or won’t be seen until the long term, they almost always won’t do it.
No, it’s education.
And I bet they blamed you when it went to shit
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Isn’t SteamOS based on Arch? Did I miss something?
the way SteamOS works is extremely different to how a regular Arch Linux runs so I wouldn’t really conclude anything from that
it just shows how little the underlying distro mattersIt’s based on Debian.
2.0 is debian based. 3.0 (the version on steamdeck) is arch based
You learn something new every day. Thanks.
Nice. So Steam Deck users can start telling everyone that they use Arch (btw)
Yeah, Windows 7 is very old. It’s definitely a concern. I keep him highly firewalled on the network so that hopefully he won’t get hacked.
I usually play on Debian, but when I contacted Steam for support regarding Proton, they said they only supported Ubuntu or Steam OS. Since Steam OS isn’t currently available for PC, that means Ubuntu.
Nvidia gpu drivers wont even install on win 7 anymore. That by itself causes huge performance issues on new games that have driver optimizations.
Probably the same story for amd drivers
I think there have been some small groups making their own security patches for windows 7
I don’t think Steam actually recommends any distro since some time anymore
The way steam works for package maintainers is basically “ok we need at least kernel xyz+, graphics drivers, valve already packaged the rest”. Supporting it is trivial unless you insist on replacing libraries steam includes as runtime with your own versions, which you shouldn’t. It’s kind of its own user-level distribution in a sense.
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And yet the Deck uses Arch…
it is kinda wild that people abandon Windows 7 because of Steam
There’s this certain subsection of Win7/8 diehards that absolutely confuse me. It’s one thing to keep using them on old systems, but I’ve seen a few people posting about their brand-new PC, equipped with RTX 4090s and 13th gen I9 processors, who are adamant on running those outdated operating systems as their only OS. Such a waste of money.
Nah I think it’s just that windows 7 and 8 was and still is quite literally one of those ones where it hit the sweet spot between good UI and UX and actually having huge range and compatibility straight off the bat. Plus everything was pretty smooth back then, but hell, nobody ever says how many viruses and dumb apps were floating around for Windows 7x32 and x64
All these people saying “use this or use that distro instead” is why Windows users don’t go into Linux. Ubuntu is a solid choice for beginners because that’s a distro with a lot of tutorials online if not the most.
I don’t get what the fuck is the problem with Ubuntu anyway.
Edit: I mean I heard the reasons many times but they are completely non-issues for me.
It’s about Ubuntu behaving lightly like Microsoft with a closed source backend for the store, having had ads in the apps drawer, putting ads on the motd in cli with apt… It’s small things like these
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There’s a lot of people out there that hate to hear this, but ubuntu is probably the best gateway to Linux we have at the moment. Go ahead, let them come in on the distro that’s pretty well supported, preconfigured with everything on and newbie friendly, then once they’ve cut their teeth, let they have the option to move to something that’s a little more tweaked.
I’ve used Ubuntu for 10 years. I love it for stability, ease, and simplicity If i need to do anything there are plenty of guides. I learned how to do a lot of cool stuff on linux but I don’t really need or want to do any of it.
Mostly I just pirate movies, use a vpn, torrent, listen to music, write. My career doesn’t require much computer stuff. Why should I try something different?
I’m not working with a huge amount of interest in or energy for complicated customization. I just wanna turn it on and have it work.
Power to you, friend. But with current snap store out of the box it’s really hard to recommend Ubuntu to anyone. Linux Mint seems such a better choice to newbies.
At the end of the day it’s not really a big deal, people should just use whatever feels best.
What is wrong with the snap store? It’s not something I’m aware of.
I go to terminal. I sudo apt-get
I get Firefox, I get my VPN, I get deluge, I get my audio player.
I use those things. I sleep well at night.
If you use apt-get you aren’t using snaps, you are unaffected.
Snap is a format created by Canonical which has a really funky proprietary back end. The default application store in Ubuntu uses this format and has been plagued with an impersonation problem. Since everyone could submit snaps there was a lot of spyware posing as legit software. My main gripe was when the snap store just decided to unilaterally close and update my Firefox while I was using it.
Linux Mint does NOT have snaps and even had a debian based version. Pretty neat
Correct me if I am wrong, but
apt-get install firefoxinstalls the snap version unless you go out of your way to fix that?Yep, it installs the snap version
apt uses debians packages and debian repositories. Unless they recently created an alias or something, it should install debian packaged version!
As a windows user who’s been doing some research and looking to switch this is really the post I needed to see. I know everyone seems to have their favourite distro and means well when suggesting them but its nice to have someone point out a distinct beginner friendly one with no caveats.
To be perfectly honest they’re all fine. Most of the major distributions are install it and run it. If you try one and you don’t like it don’t get discouraged try another. If you have trouble getting your hardware working on one try a different one.
I somewhat disagree. Sure, telling windows users they have so many options will overwhelm them so it’s best to just give them 1 or 2 options. But telling other linux users who are about to put/suggest linux on someone else’s computer that there’s better options is good.
For example, let’s take Ubuntu pushing snaps. A noob won’t know what they are, and there’s good chances they will have a bad experience with them and not understand what they are, they will probably think it’s a Linux problem rather than an Ubuntu problem and there’s a good chance they will leave linux because of them. I personally learned the problems I was having at the start of my linux journey were problems with snaps only because I read it somewhere in the zorin discord server or something like that. If it wasn’t for that I would have thought it’s a linux problem. Tho this wasn’t easy information to find and I was already well on my way to becoming a Linux nerd and I was interested in learning more, but the average user, in my experience, doesn’t know/want to look these things up and if you try to explain to them there’s a good chance you’ll lose them halfway through (which is normal, package managers aren’t a fun topic) Telling a linux user about it and that linux mint (for exampel) may be a better introduction for their resident noodles doesn’t run the risk because they’re already a linux user.
I use Ubuntu for my VMs, and Snaps never feel bad. Why are Snaps bad? At this point, I am only aware that “Snaps are bad” because people keep parroting that idea. Is there an empirical benchmark that compares the “speed” (whatever that is defined as) of a Snap app vs other packaging formats? If there is a claim to be made, there should be evidence supporting it.
If we’re going by anecdotal data, then I have had fewer Snap issues than Flatpaks and Rpm. So technically, Snaps are superior, according to my experience. At that point, it becomes an anecdotal debate, which is meaningless.
for some people snaps work, for most they don’t. If they work, we all good, but when they don’t people will blame Linux for this issue. And that’s just snaps there’s a lot of shady bs Canonical is doing. Meanwhile we know Linux Mint’s packages, for example, work well and rarely has anyone complained about them. There are some benchmarks but that isn’t the main issue.
I showed him the thread, and he agreed. He was surprised by how strongly people felt about distros.
Personally, I think I never would have gotten as many comments as I did if not for mentioning the distro!
I dislike GNOME, but I would still recommend Ubuntu to anyone, because it just works. There’s no reason to recommend Arch Linux or openSUSE etc. if someone never used (GNU/)Linux before.
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All these people saying “use this or use that distro instead” is why Windows users don’t go into Linux. Ubuntu is a solid choice for beginners
You literally did the thing you’re decrying in the very next sentence.
“The problem is everyone telling Windows users which distro to use. Which is why I’m telling them they should just use Ubuntu.”
No I did not. My actual opinion would be to recommend Nobara OS. What I did was agree with OP’s decision. It doesn’t matter in the end which they use but if someone is deadset on Ubuntu and you hear several people saying “pick mint” “no pick pop os” “no actually Debian” it becomes overwhelming. Agreeing with OP’s decision does not make me a hypocrite.
K
Windows 12 may end up being my transition to Linux, especially if they go for a subscription model. If you told me just a decade ago that Linux was a viable OS for gaming, I would have laughed at you.
Valve have outdone themselves with Proton. So have those who worked on DXVK and VKD3D.
I’ll be the first to hope for the demise of Windows…but I thought the “subscription model” rumours were all discredited. Obviously anything could happen in the future I guess.
Yes, the subscription would only apply to Windows IOT.
Win IOT is for embedded systems, so pretty much only corporate customers would be affected.
Windows 11 is my stopping point. I will use windows 10 until end of life (either myself or the os). BUT knowing windows every other os, the next one after w11 should be OK. Time will tell.
AS a c/c++ rtos Microcontroller programmer reliant on Platform io i pray they dont eol windows 10 before platformio supports Linux os’s
Maybe not your particular board, but platformio supports Linux for ages. I worked with that 6 years ago (on arch, btw).
Went back to check and it turns out Microsoft only allows it in vscode and not in vs codium Windows ten might get dropped
Don’t hate on Ubuntu. It’s a great starter distro for people who only know Win or Mac
Linux Mint Debian Edition
I’m pretty sure that this is because steam uses chromium as its backend and chromium new version doesn’t run on windows 7. It’s still not good because there are some games that won’t run on newer systems and therefore 7 is required for preservation.
As many of you pointed out, yes I agree proton is the answer if possible. YMMV
Lol 0.06% usage in November 2023
https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey
There are more linux users than windows7 users.
0.69% (nice) on windows 7 64bit. That’s 0.75% total or 0.91% including windows 8 which is also dying. This is slightly under half of the linux user base according to these statistics
Missed that indeed. Weird sorting 😅
I think the 1.91 also includes the stream deck, but for some reason it isn’t included in the list (it is included if you select only Linux). It is about 5.5x Arch so around 0.8% of the total installs.
So the discontinue versions are around the same number as Linux desktop installs.
Like others already mentioned, I would suggest Linux Mint as well. It’s better Ubuntu than Ubuntu and similarity to Windows UI would make his transition much better.
Seconded. Switched my wife to Mint two years ago, and she never cared about going back to Windows. Not that she cares about Mint, either; the point of contention was the transition, which was much smoother than she was afraid of.
Nah. It’s more, year of the piracy comeback
Have downloaded 10k songs in the last week, at 160GB so far, 22,000 total. Synced all to my phone with media monkey. Ditching any subscription services.
160gb in a phone? Thats pretty large storage for a phone
It shouldn’t be though.
Micro SD 512
or 1tb even
The price difference wasnt worth. 512 was sub $25, jumped to $100 for 1tb. This is a good start. It’s also all stored on a 15tb truenas.
No.
That also helps linux. Tried watching something on someone else’s peacock account logged into Linux, and got an error. Checked Google to see if it was available. A free site had it, in better quality streaming too! We ended up using her computer, but I was kind of amazed.
If he wants something similar to windows, get Linux mint, it’s the best parts of Debian/Ubuntu but made modern. If you can do it on Ubuntu, you can do it in mint (like online guides cuz mint is based on ubuntu if you couldn’t tell).
Or KDE Neon. Basically Kubuntu LTS, but up to date KDE Plasma and no snaps.
I started with KDE neon and loved it. For me personally, the weird partial rolling release thing was really nice. I loved seeing YT people talk about the new KDE release and all of its bells and whistles, and being able to instantly play with it on release.
The year of Linux was supposed to be somewhere in mid 1990-s…
The year of linux was 1991, since it was created there.
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What are you smoking? Linux is better in literally every way.
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Obviously because those developers are specifically making that impossible. That’s not Linux’s issue.
Also I’ve played CSGO and R6 siege on Linux before with no issues.
Also valorant, Fortnite, and Destiny 2 are shit and made by companies that are practically hostile to environments they don’t have strict control with.
Why did you have trouble? Maybe because you suck. You don’t need to distro hop. Most of us do that for fun.
The real fact of the matter here is that you’re here to be a troll.
I suggest an Ubuntu fork workout snaps, they are a headache to remove now
It doesn’t really matter for the average use though, most probably won’t really notice the app opening times and most Windows users will not care about the backend being closed source, coming from an entirely closed source OS. I will tend to recommend stock Ubuntu or Mint/PopOS at most because those actually bring some things to the table while being Ubuntu based, not being Ubuntu but with a different DE
I’ve been quite enjoying Mint as well. Granted, it’s been reeeal light use. But so far loving it. I’ve always enjoyed Debian distros. RHEL can kiss my butt. It was always frustrating to work with at work. I think Slackware was Debian? That was probably my first back in like 2004ish. Generally just works™
Nah, Slackware is just as old as Debian, and apparently SUSE branched off from Slackware. And it’s still around, although I don’t use it anymore…
most Windows users will not care about the backend being closed source
I’d have thought those windows users came to Linux because they wanted an open source OS though.
Lots of choices but I’d probably use Kubuntu if your boyfriend is new to Linux and you want this “official” Proton support (not sure that actually means much; Proton works very well on most distros). The plasma interface can be set fairly similar to windows for a newbie to feel comfortable.
It’s all just personal preference of course; I just find the Ubuntu interface annoying as someone who uses Linux and windows a lot. Personally I use Mint; very nice distro, good and stable, nice for newbies, and the default cinnamon interface is very windows like too.
RIP Windows 7, long live Linux Mint Xfce
The meme that will never ever go away.
As a former lifelong Windows user (from 2002 to 2019), I honestly don’t get why people continue using Windows in the future. It doesn’t make sense to me. They’re cracking down on liberties, increasing system requirements, and old software and games are gradually becoming less compatible. And people seem to be starting to realize that other options are becoming gradually more attractive, because Windows is now hovering below 70% while just ten years ago it was at over 90%. Meanwhile Mac has grown from 7% to 20%, and Linux is at an unprecedented 3%, and that’s not counting ChromeOS, which is slightly higher.
The mistakes Microsoft is doing can prove fatal. Because I think for most people, once they embrace Linux, even if Windows improves, they won’t wanna go back.
You’re right. And people continue to use Windows because all software is available for it. See… Adobe products, Notion, Windows games with just a double click, even the Whatsapp application, Full OneNote and do not even mention MS Office…
Yeah, I think the reason many don’t switch, is because of software availability.
Only reason I use windows is for work. All the software for industrial controls stuff is windows only. But luckily its so shit at being updated that I still have to keep a windows xp VM around for some stuff so hopefully I’ll be retired before I need to use windows 11+
I got my CNC router working via wine about 2 years ago. Was very happy when it not only worked but worked well. Thought I was going to need to setup a dedicated windows PC for it but I can just use my workshop/tinkering laptop.
I still might try and use Linux as a host for the windows VMS but I’d probably still need to keep a dual boot around can’t risk not having it in case of something that wouldn’t work with USB pass through.
